Cyber Persia
The most misrepresented and misunderstood country of the world.
by Reza Hashemi, Iran
Subscribe to this blog
Toshiba HD-DVD, The winner of format war?
Nov 8, 2007 09:34Toshiba has sent all troops to the war field to make a pretty tough christmas for Sony's Blu-Ray. In a fantastic move by Toshiba, Walmart and BestBuy, more than 90,000 HD-DVD players were sold last weekend.
Within three days, HD-DVD format significantly increased its installed base and sold nearly as many as the best-selling stand-alone Blu-ray DVD player has sold since its launch.
Toshiba A2 HD DVD was the 20th position on the Google's Hot Trends in thursday November 1st. Near 100,000 US$99 HD-DVD players sold on Nov 2. That's US$200 less than Toshiba’s US$299 list price and US$100 off retail pricing of US$199. Sony’s dominant Blu-ray standalone player,the BDP-S300, is US$499 and has shipped about 100,000 since it bowed this summer.
The Format war began in 2004 when Toshiba rejected the offer to work together with Sony. In January of 2007, BDA (Blu-ray Disc Association) declared victory over Toshiba HD-DVD.
BDA claimed that Blu-ray is the premiere high definition format of choice with 25 different companies having released Blu-ray related products and more than one million PlayStation 3s shipped to the U.S.
Considering PS3 stations sold in US and Europe and Asia, It seems that Blu-Ray is the winner of the fight and has outpaced HD-DVD with an order of 5 to 1.
But the fight has just begun!
In my opinion , Toshiba has the upper hand in the format war, although the number of installations of Blu-ray is much more than HD-DVD, but most of these installations are in form of Playstation 3 consoles.
Buying a PS3 is not a sign of consumer interest in Blu-Ray. You should consider that sales of Toshiba HD-DVD standalone players outpaced Blu-ray units by nearly 5 times as many units and this number has increased during the last weekend.
Having more standalone players means more support from major movie studios, Paramount and/or Dreamworks recently dropped support for Blu-Ray in favour of HD-DVD and joined Universal and Warner Bros studios, but the fact that Sony is itself a big movie studio (Sony Pictures/MGM) has complicated the matter. Disney and 20th Century Fox support Blu-Ray too.
In game consoles market, Microsoft XBox 360, the big PS3 rival, is going to support HD-DVD. Microsoft is not going to integrate HD-DVD into the XBox (Because of product price increase) but supports the HD-DVD format via an addon kit for XBox and is focusing on HD-DVD.
Kevin Collins, director in the Microsoft Consumer Media Technology Group said last week that the Microsoft's decision to back HD-DVD was a result of purely pragmatic concerns such as lower disc manufacturing costs and mandated managed copying, which is supposed to make it possible to exercise some fair use rights without compromising DRM concerns.
On the other hand, Apple, Dell, Samsung, Panasonic and Sharp support Blu-ray as their preferred storage device or next-gen DVD player.
At any case, this competition will not have a clear winner in the next few months and anti-trust groups in the United States and elsewhere watch the battle carefully for signs of harm to the consumer.
20 years ago, the VHS-Betamax (JVC vs Sony) battle harmed consumers, as those who bought Betamax were later forced to buy new VHS players.
The winner of this war by now are the consumers, as prices are driven down faster in an effort to attract buyers.
Latest Update: Friday, February 15, 2008
Toshiba rumored to quit HD DVD as Wal-Mart pulls support
Final Update: Fabruary 19, 2008
Toshiba Announces Discontinuation of HD DVD Businesses
- Talkback
-
The real loser is the consumer. Why you ask? Because if you bought a Toshiba A2 HD-DVD player, you bought a machine that is not HD!!! The A2 does NOT support 1080p video output. After buying a Toshiba A2 HD-DVD player, the consumer now has to spend $26.99 on HD-DVDs that they can't watch how they are intended to be viewed. You're better off sticking with you standard DVDs for $11.99.
Toshiba is using Best Buy to dump an obsolete HD-DVD player for $100. Don't fall for the scam.
Reza Hashemi needs to do some indepth research before writing this crazy propaganda.
Nov 08, 2007 11:14
"if you bought a Toshiba A2 HD-DVD player, you bought a machine that is not HD!!! "
By what definition is 720P and 1080i, NOT HD?
If what you claim were true, then the HD penetration of the developed world is nearly non-existant. By your definition the vast majority of SONY HD televisions sold up until a year ago are not HD. You're the one spreading propagana, not Mr. Hashemi.
And not all HD-DVDs support 1080P anyway, so pretty much every word you've said has been false, misleading, or inaccurate. It must feel good to no so little and yet still rant on the internet.
Nov 08, 2007 13:14
It needs to be known that Superdynamite is spreading pure lies. If you don't know much about HD, then you might believe his claim that "if you bought a Toshiba A2 HD-DVD player, you bought a machine that is not HD!!!"
Pure lies. The maximum video output for this particular player is 1080i, which is absolutely high definition. 480p, 720p, 1080i, and 1080p are all high definition signals. Yes, 1080p is the highest, but it is not the only form of HD video. In fact, 1080i is not even broadcast on television (cable, over the air, or satellite). Think Monday night football looks good on your HDTV? Yeah, that's a 1080i signal you're seeing there.
A 1080p HD signal is only available through Xbox 360 video game systems, PS3's, Blu-Ray players, and certain HD DVD players (the A20, A30, and A35). Also, you can only view a 1080p signal on a television that supports 1080p, and while connected through an HDMI cable. You cannot view 1080p through a component cable connection. Component cables support a maximum resolution of 1080i.
The simple truth is that 90% of HDTV owners possess a television that can only display a maximum resolution of 720p/1080i. In that case, a 1080p HD DVD player (or Blu-Ray player for that matter) is useless. Well, not useless, but you'll only be able to view the signal in 1080i or 720p.
If you do own a good 1080p display, you cannot tell the difference between a 1080i input and a 1080p input, because your display should automatically upconvert the 1080i signal to 1080p. This is opinion, but it is one backed in numerous writings by many professional audio/video reviewers.
I just purchased this Toshiba A2 HD DVD player. It was an upgrade from my 1st generation A1. For $98, it couldn't be beaten. I also own a PS3 which I only use for viewing Blu-Ray movies. And finally I also own a 70" Sony 1080p display. And you know what? I cannot tell the difference between my HD DVD player's 1080i output, and my PS3's 1080p output, even with my 1080p television.
Superdynamite is a Blu-Ray fan boy and nothing else. Do not believe his lies. He, like most other Blu-Ray only supports are extremely angry because consumers can purchase an HD DVD for less than $100. The cheapest Blu-Ray player is the new 60 gig PS3 which sells for $399. Because the Blu-Ray supporters are angry/nervous about losing the war, their claim is that 1080i is not "Real HD." That's total BS. Again, nobody broadcasts in 1080p; not ABC, not CBS, not NBC, and not Fox. Both Dish Network and DIrecTV have a maximum video output of 1080i as well.
The post above by Superdynamite is propaganda, not this article. Blu-Ray only supporters are just scared that they're finally in danger of losing this format war. Keep that in mind when you ask a Blu-Ray only supporter if Blu-Ray is better than HD DVD.
Finally, if you must have a player that supports a 1080p output, Blu-Ray is not your only choice. As I mentioned above, Toshiba's A20, A30, and A35 all support 1080p. You can find the A20 and the A30 for $299 or less, which is still at least $100 cheaper than the cheapest Blu-Ray player.
Know the facts when chosing a format. Do not listen to opinions, because most of them are just lies anyway.
Hope I helped!
Nov 08, 2007 13:18
It really is too bad there is so much fanboy rhetoric that gets posted. They shut down the AVS forums because of it. I do realize there is a lot at stake being on the losing end of a dead format but spreading false information to push your cause is misleading and wrong. Let the "real" facts speak for themselves.
Here is my 5 cents.
1080i IS HIGH-DEF. So is 720p, 1080p etc. It all is high def. It has been stated and proven on every high-def content website over and over again that unless your watching content on a 52" television or larger that you cannot and I repeat "cannot" tell the difference between 1080i and 1080p on anything smaller than 52-inches. Furthermore, on televisions larger than 52" the difference is minimal at best. I have a Sharp 52" LCD hooked up to a PS3 and HD-A2 and the quality of the movies played are identical. The HD-A2 player is 1080i and the PS3 Blu-ray player is 1080p and there is no diference. NONE! Also remember Image quality is greatly affected by your television. I have a 2 1/2 year old 720p 42" Sharp LCD in my gym and the image quality is better than the current 1080p Vizio LCDs and Westinghouse LCDs.
I also have a 61" Samsung DLP in my living room hooked up to my xbox HD-DVD player and it's awesome too. I hooked up the HD-A2 to the 61" Samsung and the image quality was nearly identical to my xbox HD-DVD add-on running @ 1080p native through VGA. My Samsung automatically upconverted the HD-A2 1080i signal to 1080p so it really didn't make a difference. Unless your a videophile you wouldn't notice any differences. J6P (average comsumers) who purchased the Toshiba A2s at Walmart, BB, CC players definitely won't be able to notice a difference. For them its about price. The most for the money. Slashing the Toshiba players was a brilliant move. Hopefully Blu will follow but I am not sure they will since it would require them to slash the PS3 further which I don't think they are willing to do.
As for Blu-ray being a superior format, give me a break. Sell the snake oil to someone else. I have movies in both formats and again the quality is the same. I honestly think Blu is at a disadvantage when it comes to the hardware. The reason I have a PS3 for Blu-ray is because it can be updated through the ethernet. Customers who are currently buying Blu-ray players may not be able to take advantage of future features on the blu-ray discs because the format has not been finalized. They are not future-proof. Toshiba players do not have this problem. Imagine how a Blu-ray customer is going to feel when that $800 player they bought last year doesn't play all the features on the new Blu-ray release they just bought. It will be a hassle to get a firmware upgrade via a blu-ray disc when you have no ethernet port to do it on the fly. Fortunately I don't have this problem since I have my PS3.
All things being equal which I think they are between the quality of the software regarding the two formats ( My wife and son don't care about disc size, lossless audio, AACS etc.) It basically comes down to hardware, content and the most important one, "PRICE. " Toshiba with $99 players and sub $200 A3 players, the BDA has their work cut out for them since their cheapest player is a $399.99 PS3. Toshiba just brought their "A" game to the table and that kind of price drop will greatly increase the user base. I think in this case, a greater dedicated user base via stand alone players will be something the content providers cannot ignore.
One last comment regarding all the negative press to Paramount and WB being bribed etc. Bottom line is this is business. And you can bet all of the studio houses and that includes Fox and Disney too took some kind of concession whether they admit it or not. No matter what fanboys want to believe, superior format this, superior fomat that, it's all about business and there is a lot at stake. I really don't care who wins since I have both formats but it sure is funny reading all the cr@p that gets posted.
Nov 08, 2007 14:56
PS.
Like the others said, ignore that first post. He's either misinformed "not likely" or biased and trying to spread false information to support his biased cause "likely."
Like I said before, I don't support one over the other i just wish people would be more factual, or at the very least state a comment as opinion not fact.
Nov 08, 2007 15:16
@superdynamite
David Carnoy from CNET has a very informative review in this respect, 1080i vs. 1080p HDTV: should you care? (By David Carnoy,2005, reviews.cnet.com... )
Or a recent article from hometheater mag: (1080i v. 1080p
By Geoffrey Morrison , www.hometheatermag.com... )
Nov 08, 2007 18:44
@Brodee,toyshop, vciad
I agree, thank you very much for helpful comments
Nov 08, 2007 19:02
I agree with Rez, Brodee, toyshop and vciad. superdynamite is an idiot. This is the reason the price drop is so important... "My opinion"
If you bought your HD-DVD player for under $200 and your format loses your still left with a very good up-converting DVD player for an acceptable price. If you spent $400 dollars or more on your Blu-ray player and it lost the format war, your sitting with a very expensive up-converting dvd player unless you own a PS3. Less risk with a lower price, greater risk with a higher price. Common sense says the average consumer will choose the lower price every time. Every business model says the guy that can offer the most for the least amount wins. The DBA will have no choice but to answer with some king of promotion. Rez is right, I have never seen a premium format drop so quickly in price. This is fantastic for the consumer. 90,000 or more people bought Toshiba hd-dvd players for $99 just a year and a half or two after it debued. Others are buying the Toshiba A3s now that they are under $200. This is very rare in the high-tech world to have a premium technology like high-definition fall so fast. After all we as consumers dictate who wins the war, not the companies themselves. IF we don't buy their products, they don't make profits and the format dies...Sony's umd anyone. How about Beta or mini-disc. History does have a way of repeating itself. If you have a high-def TV, your missing out without some kind of high-def player. HD-DVD is now under $200 and the price is right to buy in. Once again, lower risk with a lesser price. Hopefully BDA will follow but as it stands $400 is too much a risk for me to buy in if blu-ray loses.
Nov 09, 2007 00:26
About Reza Hashemi
Reza Hashemi is a Web entrepreneur.He has an engineering degree in computer hardware and a Master in computer systems and networks architecture. He has experienced a condensed history of computers, operating systems and dot com generations. In his younger days, he mastered the art of playing computer games and programming for Commodore 64 then IBM 370 mainframes with card readers in university and hooked up to the Internet via a 19.6Kbps shared connection in 1993. He is also a university instructor, IT consultant and founder/CEO/board member of a couple of e-businesses since Y2K.
Recent Comments
Most Discussed
Browse Archive
FebruarySponsored links
Panasonic Festive Offers
Purchase Panasonic TV/Camera/Camcorder to enjoy special gift bundles.
The Internet Show 2010, 21-22 Apr 2010, Singapore
FREE admission for visitors who pre-register online. Register Today!
Olympus PEN, EP-1 & EP-2
Not a Compact. Not an SLR... It's a PEN!
The new Citi DIVIDEND World MasterCard
Get up to 5% cash back for every dollar charged to your card.
Crack the code
Crack the code with Western Digital and stand to win the new PS3 (slim gaming console).
Just right. Nothing more.
The VAIO X Series. It’s everything you desire and nothing you don’t.
Have you made your New Year salary resolution?
Join activeBizPros and find out the average salaries of business professionals
CNET Asia is now on Facebook!
Be part of the most happening tech community in Asia on Facebook
CNET Asia TV
Watch gadget reviews, quick tips, movie trailers and more for FREE.
